2014 Retro Uprising Gaming Champ - Page 7

**ebinsugewa** · 04-02-2014, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hocus pocus

Which score clears the game then?
I though that you clear the game if you complete the 5 minutes.

To clear the game you must destroy the final boss. If you simply time out the 5:00, it does not count as a clear, or else everyone would clear the game.

**cheetah32p** · 04-02-2014, 10:23 PM

I should be the new Monster Slider champion now! I had a 408,000 score today! I haven't seen that score updated yet either!

**hocus pocus** · 04-02-2014, 10:28 PM

Which stage did you get and which character?

**Barra** · 04-02-2014, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheetah32p

I should be the new Monster Slider champion now! I had a 408,000 score today! I haven't seen that score updated yet either!

You literally submitted it a couple of hours ago

**cheetah32p** · 04-06-2014, 09:54 PM

I wish the scores were a bit closer kind of! I like when the scores are closer to make it more interesting rather than someone being so far ahead that you can't really catch up almost even if you tried! Kind of like Crib! Its more interesting when your scores are closer to make it more exciting rather than someone too far ahead! I know some people think that if a person is too far ahead for scores that it has to make a person work harder to try to get that score but to me in response to a competition, to me when the scores are closer makes for better excitement! I was just wondering what some people might think about this?

---------- Post added at 08:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:51 PM ----------

I made it to like stage 5 I think! I can't remember who I used as the character! I think it was the older guy or something or the younger guy with the cool sword! One or the other! Not the girl! That was pretty funny! I couldn't get a good score at all using her! LOL! :-) This is for Monster Slider! :-). I wanted to be a first person to maybe submit a clear for this game but its a lot harder than it sure looks!

**Barra** · 04-06-2014, 11:50 PM

Its only april. Plenty of time left to play.

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheetah32p

I wish the scores were a bit closer kind of! I like when the scores are closer to make it more interesting rather than someone being so far ahead that you can't really catch up almost even if you tried! Kind of like Crib! Its more interesting when your scores are closer to make it more exciting rather than someone too far ahead! I know some people think that if a person is too far ahead for scores that it has to make a person work harder to try to get that score but to me in response to a competition, to me when the scores are closer makes for better excitement! I was just wondering what some people might think about this?

I agree with my friend cheetah, I 'd prefer a scoring system like 25, 15, 10, 7 etc. Or you can give points up to first 15 or 20 players.
Because now we have some big first scores in games like dragon's fury, pepper, metal slug and you see players within the ten, but receive a percent like 5% or 7%

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheetah32p

I made it to like stage 5 I think! I can't remember who I used as the character! I think it was the older guy or something or the younger guy with the cool sword! One or the other! Not the girl! That was pretty funny! I couldn't get a good score at all using her! LOL! :-) This is for Monster Slider! :-). I wanted to be a first person to maybe submit a clear for this game but its a lot harder than it sure looks!

I also went to 5th, but only 297,000. Seems you made bigger or more chains.
The bigger chain I 've done is 7.
Yes, that girl is too difficult :-) And screams something like "vorithiaaaa"....

**Kong** · 04-07-2014, 02:54 PM

The percent bonus weights some games slightly heavier than others. Dragon's Fury is the most extreme. I intended for a clear to give 10 extra points but the 200M end bonus causes the clear bonus to be around 100 instead. I think the 200M bonus shouldn't be counted when calculating the percent bonus.

The big point spread is mostly caused by it still being early in the year and only 3 people (First, Second and Fourth place) have submitted in all 14 games. TodayIsForgotten is in 3rd place even though he still has 3 zeros. Putting him in a good position for a run on first.

The bonuses don't make much of a difference in the rankings. See spoiler.

( Click to show/hide )

Not counting the 200M clear bonus in Dragon's Fury. Metal Slug would be the heaviest weighted game and Ironman would be the least.

If Player A was amazing in Metal Slug and sucked at Ironman and Player B sucked at Metal Slug but was amazing at Ironman then Player A would receive about 30 more points than Player B. That isn't very fair but it is only 30 points in a contest to reach around 2,000 and that is the most extreme example (not counting Dragon's Fury which is closer to 90 instead of 30 and I wouldn't be opposed to changing).

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

The bonuses don't make much of a difference in the rankings. See spoiler.

There is a great difference. With the percent, my difference with maxh is 459 points. Without the percent is just 209 points.

Quote:

I think the 200M bonus shouldn't be counted when calculating the percent bonus.

Doesn't look like wise to make exception only for one game.

**Kong** · 04-07-2014, 05:01 PM

Comparing 459 to 209 is apples to oranges. The total possible points is also reduced. With percent bonuses your score is 78% of Max's. Without them your score is 80%. If you remove the Dragon's Fury Clear bonus then your score is 81% of Max's. That means with the exception of Dragon's Fury you are gaining more advantage from the percent bonus than Max is. Mostly because of your Metal Slug score.

The reason for a suggested special exception in Dragon's Fury is because it is different than all the other games. When you reach the final boss you will have about 30-50 Million points. If you beat the final boss you will have 230-250 Million points. That means clearing the game increases your score by nearly 87%. That is significantly different than all the other games and disrupts the original intention of the scoring system. We were not aware of this huge bonus when picking the games or creating the percent bonus.

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

Comparing 459 to 209 is apples to oranges. The total possible points is also reduced. With percent bonuses your score is 78% of Max's. Without them your score is 80%. If you remove the Dragon's Fury Clear bonus then your score is 81% of Max's. That means with the exception of Dragon's Fury you are gaining more advantage from the percent bonus than Max is. Mostly because of your Metal Slug score.

The points difference from percent between maxh and me is about 250 points, as numbers say.
I know that the exception of Dragon's fury would be an advantage for me, but I wrote what is the right, not what is good for me.
My final metal slug score will be 2,700,000 points or more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

The reason for a suggested special exception in Dragon's Fury is because it is
different than all the other games. When you reach the final boss you will have about 30-50 Million points. If you beat the final boss you will have 230-250 Million points. That means clearing the game increases your score by nearly 87%. That is significantly different than all the other games and disrupts the original intention of the scoring system. We were not aware of this huge bonus when picking the games or creating the percent bonus.

If you dont want to repeal the whole percent system, then go ahead and make that exception of 200 million.

**Kong** · 04-07-2014, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hocus pocus

Why you get 12 date points, although we have April?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

That is a bug. Not sure why yet but I will fix it next week. Max noticed it last week.

This date bonus bug was fixed just now. The date bonus is not measured in months. It divides the year by 12 then rounds the date to the nearest whole number. It works out to where it decreases by one sometime around the 15th of each month.

---------- Post added at 07:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:10 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by hocus pocus

If you dont want to repeal the whole percent system, then go ahead and make that exception of 200 million.

I will wait to hear from Max (only affects him so far) and others.

Quote:

The meaning "apples to oranges" needs explanation to me

It is an English expression that means comparing two things that should not be directly compared.
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apples_and_oranges"]Apples and oranges - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

The point gap would be smaller without the bonuses but only because there would be fewer total points to go around. Moving up in rank would still be equally difficult no matter how we measure it. The bonuses have a fairly small effect on the rankings. With or without bonuses second place is about 10% away from first, third is about 15% from first and fourth is about 20%.

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

I will wait to hear from Max (only affects him so far) and others.

So maxh will lose 100 points(the rest of us, 12 or less). I dont think he 'll agree :-)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

The point gap would be smaller without the bonuses but only because there would be fewer total points to go around. Moving up in rank would still be equally difficult no matter how we measure it. The bonuses have a fairly small effect on the rankings. With or without bonuses second place is about 10% away from first, third is about 15% from first and fourth is about 20%.

Yes, but still means 250 points profit for me.

There's also a pepper 2 matter,
I recently made a 440,000 score but was deleted because there was a bug.
Then I made another score of 224,000. Although this score was checked, the board has the clickable option Request Score Verification.
There are 2 scores bigger than this, which have not been checked. Maybe you should check them too, in order to be sure that there wasn't that bug?

**maxh** · 04-07-2014, 07:10 PM

Quote:

I will wait to hear from Max (only affects him so far) and others.

Go for it. Adjust away.

**D.B. Cooper** · 04-07-2014, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kong

The reason for a suggested special exception in Dragon's Fury is because it is different than all the other games. When you reach the final boss you will have about 30-50 Million points. If you beat the final boss you will have 230-250 Million points. That means clearing the game increases your score by nearly 87%. That is significantly different than all the other games and disrupts the original intention of the scoring system. We were not aware of this huge bonus when picking the games or creating the percent bonus.

This is exactly why I don't like the percentage scoring system. In this case it's a bonus that's caused the problem but there is also the risk that someone comes along and just blows everyone's score away on a certain game. Not a big deal as this is all for fun but I'm thinking when all is said and done, you will recognize the weakness of this type of scoring and not use it again in the future. The CAG community has been all through this already which is why the Battle of the Arcades uses a straight point system. But this is probably one of those subjects you'll never get everyone to agree on.

**Barra** · 04-07-2014, 10:24 PM

I think the % system works when the games have a staggered release ie not all at the same time. You cant then pick and choose games with the biggest point differentials as you have no idea whats up next.
In this case, probably not the best, but its also not that bad as the competition is so long. Im sure plenty of other people could finish Dragon's Fury by the end of the year if they wanted to.

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barra

Im sure plenty of other people could finish Dragon's Fury by the end of the year if they wanted to.

I m not so sure. Pinballs like this are mostly games of luck.
You need to play many of them until you meet the luck you want.
Beisdes, this particular pinball has no great interest. You only want to make those small extras of 4 million, nothing else

**Barra** · 04-07-2014, 11:24 PM

Pinball isnt luck. Its mostly skill. Yeah granted pinball video games are probably higher in luck than real ones, but it still takes a bit of skill. You will never get lucky and just pull out a 200mil point game

**D.B. Cooper** · 04-07-2014, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barra

I think the % system works when the games have a staggered release ie not all at the same time. You cant then pick and choose games with the biggest point differentials as you have no idea whats up next.
In this case, probably not the best, but its also not that bad as the competition is so long. Im sure plenty of other people could finish Dragon's Fury by the end of the year if they wanted to.

One thing that would help is to require a player to have submitted a score for all games before any of their scores count. This defends against someone who isn't even interested in the contest but really good at one of the games from ruining one of them.

**Barra** · 04-07-2014, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.B. Cooper

One thing that would help is to require a player to have submitted a score for all games before any of their scores count. This defends against someone who isn't even interested in the contest but really good at one of the games from ruining one of them.

Yep agree 100% with this.

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barra

Pinball isnt luck. Its mostly skill. Yeah granted pinball video games are probably higher in luck than real ones, but it still takes a bit of skill. You will never get lucky and just pull out a 200mil point game

Pinball my friend is mainly luck. When you are in danger to lose any time your ball from the corners, do you call this skill?
For 200 mil, you need luck to get all those extras of 4 mil.

**Barra** · 04-07-2014, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hocus pocus

Pinball my friend is mainly luck. When you are in danger to lose any time your ball from the corners, do you call this skill?
For 200 mil, you need luck to get all those extras of 4 mil.

Have you ever played a real pinball machine? Id doubt it.
Why are the same players always winning the pinball championships around the world?
You have to learn to control the ball, as well as when and how to nudge.
Great players dont let their ball go near the corners. They control it into the shots they want to hit

**hocus pocus** · 04-07-2014, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barra

Have you ever played a real pinball machine? Id doubt it.

Why are the same players always winning the pinball championships around the world?

You have to learn to control the ball, as well as when and how to nudge.

Great players dont let their ball go near the corners. They control it into the shots they want to hit

Yes I have. I m relative with pinballs, thats why I' m talking.

For the same reason poker's same players use to win.

You think I can't control the ball? And how did I get 18 mil?
I prefer technique games, not games which depend on luck.

Even if you are the greatest player, you cant always control the corners.

Quote:

Agree. Pinball is different but still requires great skill to be a great player

Who disagrees on this? Of course requires skill. But luck is the big boss.
Between two players in the same skill, the luckiest wins.

**Slime Slayer** · 04-08-2014, 12:08 AM

Pinball highscores are among the fewest highscores influenced by luck.

**hocus pocus** · 04-08-2014, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevencassidy13

Pinball highscores are among the fewest highscores influenced by luck.

And which are the games which have much influence from luck then?...